PopTalks Podcast | Episode 2 Launches September 28
Listen now on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or YouTube.
Since January 2025, ICE has arrested more than 460,000 people — roughly three times the pace of the year before. On any given day, more than 73,000 people are held in ICE detention, a record high.
In this week’s episode of PopTalks podcast, Dr. Thoai Ngo sits down with Lee Gelernt, Senior Attorney with the ACLU's Immigrants' Rights Project, to unpack what's behind those numbers: the invocation of an 18th-century wartime law, the quiet restructuring of immigration courts, and the growing evidence — from public health research to firsthand testimony — of what enforcement at this scale is doing to families and communities across the country.
Gelernt has spent more than three decades litigating immigrants' rights cases, including the family separation case behind one of the most searing scenes in the documentary The Fight. In this conversation, he shares what keeps him going, why he believes public pushback is essential, and why he's still hopeful the country will come through this period.
"Things have been cyclical in the immigration area over the course of our history, and we've had other bad periods where immigrants have been scapegoated. But as a country, we usually come out of that — so not to be futile, to keep pushing, because we will come out of this eventually."
In this episode:
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The scale of ICE enforcement since January 2025 — and how we can take action
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The Alien Enemies Act of 1798 and its use against an alleged Venezuelan gang
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How immigration courts are being reshaped from within the executive branch
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Why public health research and testimony has been "absolutely critical" in landmark litigation
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What keeps Gelernt going after 30+ years of this work — and why he's still hopeful
PopTalks brings leading scientists, policymakers, advocates, innovators, and community leaders into candid conversations about the forces shaping population health and our collective well-being.
Let’s get into it. You’re invited to listen here.